开路电缆显示S11为+7 dB

我发现了问题。
我输入标准＃1 SHORT（M）之一的偏移延迟为93 ps，当它应该是0.093 ps时。
所以这是错误的1000倍。我很高兴这个问题得到了解决。
戴夫



     以下为原文

  I found the problem. I'd entered the offset delay of one of Standard #1 SHORT(M) as 93 ps, when it should have been 0.093 ps. So it was wrong by a factor of 1000. I'm glad that is solved. 

Dave

你好，戴夫。
昨天我遇到了同样的问题：在E5071C ENA分析仪上进行完全一个端口校准后，当同轴电缆刚刚打开时，我看到S11参数的值大于1（在线性模式下）或高于0 dB的对数值。
我还有校准标准，未在分析仪的固件中列出。
我不是一个熟练的实验者，只与该设备打交道几个月。
因此，我可以从您的经验中得出结论，我输入ENA的标准参数有问题。
我不记得为我的标准（8810B1和8807C）输入了哪个延迟时间，并且找不到它应该具有的值。
您在哪里找到了标准的延迟时间？
或者你以某种方式计算它？
感恩节快乐，Valentin



     以下为原文

  Hello, Dave.
I met the same problem yesterday: I saw values of S11 parameter higher than 1 (in linear mode) or higher than 0 dB in logarithmic when coaxial cable was just open after full one port calibration on E5071C ENA Analyzer. And I also have calibration standards that are not listed in the firmware of the Analyzer. I am not a proficient experimentator and have deal with the equipment only for a few months.

So, I can conclude from you experience that something is wrong with the parameters of standards I entered to ENA. 
I don't remember which delay time is entered for my standards (8810B1 and 8807C) and cannot find which values it should have. Where did you find the delay time for your standards? Or did you somehow calculate it?

Happy Thanksgiving,
Valentin

> {quote：title = MadRus写道：} {quote}>你好，戴夫。
你好8810B1>我昨天遇到了同样的问题：在E5071C ENA分析仪上完全一个端口校准后，当同轴电缆刚刚打开时，我看到S11参数的值大于1（在线性模式下）或高于0 dB的对数值。
我还有校准标准，未在分析仪的固件中列出。
我不是一个熟练的实验者，只与该设备打交道几个月。
我不认为我在一个端口cal上遇到这个问题。
它只在一个两端口cal。
>因此，我可以从您的经验中得出结论，我输入ENA的标准参数有问题。
>我不记得为我的标准（8810B1和8807C）输入了哪个延迟时间，并且找不到它应该具有的值。
您在哪里找到了标准的延迟时间？
或者你以某种方式计算它？
从一个快速的谷歌看，你的校准套件的部件看起来像是来自Maury Microwave http://www.maurymw.com/pdf/datasheets/2Z-025P.pdf而不是安捷伦。
在这种情况下，在这种情况下，Maury Microwave应该能够告诉你参数。
从我所看到的情况来看，8810B1是N男性开放，8807C是N753系列的N男短。
我不确定这是否适用于所有8753系列设备，但我很确定8753A预期的N cal套件是HP 85032B，因为该套件在8753A手册中作为8753A的附件列出
。
没有列出其他N cal套件。
所以我的预感是，如果您可以在ENA中选择85032B校准套件，那应该没问题。
但最好的办法是问Maury Microwave。
您需要的不仅仅是偏移量。
对于开路，除电容参数C0，C1，C2和C3外，还需要一个偏移长度。
这些是polynomail中的系数，描述了边缘电容如何随频率变化。
我从85032B手册中获取了数据，该手册可在Agilent网站上找到。
我的猜测是来自85032B的数据对你来说没问题，但是要求Maury Microwave看起来更合理。
Dave这对我来说，你需要的参数可能是85032B校准套件的参数。
实际上，由于其仅被评定为6GHz，因此短路的电感可忽略不计，因此L0 = L1 = L2 = L3 = 0。
但对于18 GHz套件，这些L值将不为零。
>感恩节快乐，> Valentin



     以下为原文

  > {quote:title=MadRus wrote:}{quote}
> Hello, Dave.

Hello 8810B1 

> I met the same problem yesterday: I saw values of S11 parameter higher than 1 (in linear mode) or higher than 0 dB in logarithmic when coaxial cable was just open after full one port calibration on E5071C ENA Analyzer. And I also have calibration standards that are not listed in the firmware of the Analyzer. I am not a proficient experimentator and have deal with the equipment only for a few months.

I don't think I got this problem on a one-port cal. It was only on a two port cal. 

> So, I can conclude from you experience that something is wrong with the parameters of standards I entered to ENA. 
> I don't remember which delay time is entered for my standards (8810B1 and 8807C) and cannot find which values it should have. Where did you find the delay time for your standards? Or did you somehow calculate it?

From a quick Google, it looks like the parts from your cal kits are from Maury Microwave

http://www.maurymw.com/pdf/datasheets/2Z-025P.pdf

not Agilent. In which case, In which case Maury Microwave should be able to tell you the parameters. From what I could see, the 8810B1 is an N male open and 8807C an N male short for the 8753 series. I don't know for sure if this applies to all 8753 series units, but I'm pretty certain the N cal kit expected by the 8753A is an HP 85032B, since that kit is listed as an accessory for the 8753A in the 8753A manual. No other N cal kits are listed. So my hunch is that if you can select an 85032B cal kit in your ENA, that should be OK. But the best bet is to ask Maury Microwave. 

You need more than just an offset. For the open, you need an offset length, in addition to capacitance parameters C0, C1, C2 and C3. These are coefficients in a polynomail which describe how the fringing capacitance varies with frequency. 

I got my data out of the manual for the 85032B, which is available on the Agilent site. My guess is that the data from the 85032B will be okay for you, but asking Maury Microwave seems more sensible. 

Dave 

This rather indicates to me, the parametes you need are probably those for the 85032B cal kit. 





Actually, since its only rated to 6 GHz, the inductance of the short is negligable, so L0=L1=L2=L3=0. But for an 18 GHz kit, those L values will be non-zero. 

> Happy Thanksgiving,
> Valentin

你好，戴夫。
非常感谢您的详细解答。
我今天已经向Maury Microwave提出了标准参数的要求。
在我们的ENA校准套件列表中，我找到了85032B / F和85032F。
应用85032F在开放式非端接同轴电缆的S11值方面给出了更好的结果。
这次它在某些频率范围内仅超过0.5-1％。
在关于分析仪校准套件定义的表格脚注（http://na.tm.agilent.com/pna/caldefs/stddefs.html）中，我找到了二手标准：** Cal标准性别，用于预制
- ENA / ENA-l固件的定义校准标准标签，表示测试端口的连接器性能。
它是来自cal标准或DUT端的连接器性别的异性。
所以，我有男性标准，因此在校准时我在固件中使用短（f）和开（f）。
再次感谢。
瓦伦丁



     以下为原文

  Hello, Dave.
Thank you very much for the detailed answer. 
I  have written request for the parameters of standards to Maury Microwave today.
In the list of calibration kits of our ENA I have found 85032B/F and 85032F. Applying 85032F gave better results in terms of S11 value at open not terminated coaxial cable. This time it exceeded 1 in some frequency regions only on 0.5-1%. 

In the footnotes of table about the calibration kits definitions for Analyzers (http://na.tm.agilent.com/pna/caldefs/stddefs.html) I found for used standards:
** The Cal standard sex, used in the pre-defined calibration standard label of the ENA / ENA-l firmware, indicates the connector sex of the test port end.  It is the opposite sex from the connector sex of the cal standard or DUT end.
So, I have male standards and therefore at calibration I used short(f) and open(f) in firmware.

Thanks, once again.
Valentin

> {quote：title = MadRus写道：} {quote}>你好，戴夫。
>非常感谢您的详细解答。
>我今天已经向Maury Microwave提出了标准参数的要求。
当我问他们什么时，他们很快就回应了。
>在我们的ENA校准套件列表中，我找到了85032B / F和85032F。
应用85032F在开放式非端接同轴电缆的S11值方面给出了更好的结果。
这次它在某些频率范围内仅超过0.5-1％。
在我看来，0 dB附近的噪音在开放时非常小。
想不到我的头脑，但我认为低于0.1分贝。
我认为85032B对于你的套件可能比85032F更准确，尽管你说你用85032F可以获得更好的效果。
在本质上。
*您拥有的组件来自为8753系列设计的校准套件。
* 8753系列（至少我的旧版8753A），支持85032B校准套件，而不是85032F。
我有点怀疑当时有85032F可用。
>在关于分析仪校准套件定义的表格脚注（http://na.tm.agilent.com/pna/caldefs/stddefs.html）中，我找到了二手标准：> ** Cal标准性别，用于
ENA / ENA-1固件的预定义校准标准标签，指示测试端口端的连接器性别。
它是来自cal标准或DUT端的连接器性别的异性。
>因此，我有男性标准，因此在校准时我在固件中使用短（f）和开（f）。
是的，我认为惠普这样做会让我们感到困惑。
最糟糕的是，如果你看到Open -F-这意味着女性开放，这显然是男性测试端口。
打开（F）表示男性打开，进入女性测试端口。
即，Open（F）*与Open -F-不相同。
>再次感谢。
> Valentin欢迎您。
但我会检查一些对安捷伦人来说很重要的事情，因为我对这个话题知之甚少。
您可能需要阅读应用说明“为Agilent Vector网络分析仪指定校准标准品和试剂盒（AN 1287-11）”85032B的手册中包含标准定义。
对于那些85032F http://cp.literature.agilent.com/litweb/pdf/85032-90021.pdf而言，情况并非如此，您需要在网上查找它们。
我相信安捷伦这样做，所以您获得的信息尽可能准确和最新。
当你完成所有工作后，请回来告诉我们！
我很快就会购买85032F，因为我的8720D固件直接支持，而85032B不支持。
8720D是一款非常古老的VNA，但没有8753那么久。戴夫



     以下为原文

  > {quote:title=MadRus wrote:}{quote}
> Hello, Dave.
> Thank you very much for the detailed answer. 
> I  have written request for the parameters of standards to Maury Microwave today.

When I asked them for something, they were pretty quick to respond. 

> In the list of calibration kits of our ENA I have found 85032B/F and 85032F. Applying 85032F gave better results in terms of S11 value at open not terminated coaxial cable. This time it exceeded 1 in some frequency regions only on 0.5-1%. 

On mine, the noise around the 0 dB is quite small on an open. Can't think off the top of my head, but under 0.1 dB I think. 

I think the 85032B is likely to be more accurate than the 85032F for your kit, despite you say you get better looking results with 85032F. In essence. 

* The components you have are from a cal kit designed for 8753 series.
* 8753 series (at least my old 8753A), supports the 85032B cal kit, not an 85032F. I somewhat doubt the 85032F was available back then. 
 
> In the footnotes of table about the calibration kits definitions for Analyzers (http://na.tm.agilent.com/pna/caldefs/stddefs.html) I found for used standards:
> ** The Cal standard sex, used in the pre-defined calibration standard label of the ENA / ENA-l firmware, indicates the connector sex of the test port end.  It is the opposite sex from the connector sex of the cal standard or DUT end.
> So, I have male standards and therefore at calibration I used short(f) and open(f) in firmware.

Yes, I think HP done that to confuse us. Just to make matters worst, if you see

Open -F-     that means a female open , which obviously goes on a male test port. 
Open (F)     means a male open, to go on a female test port. 

i.e Open(F) is *not* the same as Open -F-. 

> Thanks, once again.
> Valentin

You are welcome. But I'd check anything that is important with the Agilent guys, as I don't know much about this topic. You might want to read the application note  "Specifying Calibration Standards and Kits for Agilent Vector Network Analyzers (AN 1287-11)" 

The manual for the 85032B has the standard definitions in it. This is not so for the 85032F 

http://cp.literature.agilent.com/litweb/pdf/85032-90021.pdf

for those, you need to look them up on the web. I believe Agilent do that, so the information you get is as accurate and up to date as possible. 

When you have it all worked out, come back and tell us about it!  

I'll probably buy an 85032F soon, as that is supported directly in the firmware of my 8720D, whereas the 85032B is not. The 8720D is a pretty old VNA, but not as old as the 8753. 


Dave