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[问答]

使用通用输入引脚而不是GCLK引脚的实际缺点是什么?

我正在尝试为Avnet S6 LX9 Microboard构建一个小型附加板。
该板有两个扩展接头 - 但它们都没有GCLK输入引脚。
我的电路板将采用时钟输入信号(范围约为16-64 MHz),通过DCM,并使用该信号为外部ADC和放大器提供时钟。
内部基于BRAM的FIFO。
DCM将用于频率合成(4x时钟mul)以及动态相位调整。
我不关心源时钟和放大器之间的绝对相位关系。
DCM的输出。
无论如何,我将使用DCM调整相位,以便将ADC样本与外部时钟上发生的事件对齐。
一旦样本排成一行,我希望相位关系保持不变。
那么 - 使用通用输入引脚而不是GCLK引脚的实际缺点是什么?
我无法找到为什么这样做很糟糕的细节,只是确实如此。
我想知道我是否应该开始寻找替代硬件,或者我是否能够逃脱我目前的计划。
这是否意味着抖动增加,电压/温度变化延迟可预测性降低等等?
在我的应用程序中我可以忍受一些缺点,但我甚至不知道它们到底是什么!
谢谢,
-Colin

以上来自于谷歌翻译


以下为原文

I'm trying to build a small add-on board for the Avnet S6 LX9 Microboard. This board has two extension headers - but neither of them have a GCLK input pin.

My board will take a clock input signal (range about 16-64 MHz), pass it through a DCM, and use that signal to clock an external ADC & internal BRAM-based FIFO. The DCM will be used for both frequency synthesis (4x clock mul) along with dynamic phase adjustment.

I don't care about the absolute phase relationship between source clock & output of DCM. I'll be adjusting the phase with the DCM anyway to line up ADC samples with events occurring on the external clock. Once the samples are lined up I want that phase relationship to remain constant.

So - what is the actual downside of using a generic input pin instead of GCLK pin? I haven't been able to find much detail in why doing this is bad, just that it is. I'd like to get an idea if I should start looking for alternative hardware, or if I will be able to get away with what I currently have planned. Does it mean increased jitter, less predictable delay with voltage/temp change, etc? Some downsides I can live with in my application, but I don't even know what they are exactly!

Thanks,

    -Colin

回帖(5)

潘晶燕

2019-7-26 10:27:17
科林,
如果你不关心绝对阶段,那就没有问题。
IBUF,专用时钟引脚路由具有受控的已知延迟(对于工具),并且使用常规结构互连的通用IO引脚将具有比专用路由更多的延迟,但实际上没有性能差异

确实,如果您使用常规互连进行所有时钟路由,则可能会有更多抖动,但是从IOB到最近的全局缓冲区访问点(或DCM)的短路径不足以引入抖动。
通过为DCM反馈路径选择相同的资源,您实际上可以补偿变化。
这可能需要在FPGA_editor中手动放置hte路由,但可以提供更好的解决方案(需要花费一些时间和精力,以及将来的可维护性)。
您将收到警告或多个警告,您可能会忽略这些警告。
延迟将随着过程(芯片到另一个芯片),电压和温度而变化;
但是,它也会为IBUF做到这一点。
将BUFG用于DCM反馈旨在弥补这一点。
如果您没有将性能推得太远,您将能够选择固定的延迟采样点。
否则,您将需要一种训练序列,以找到每块电路板的最佳采样点,如果电压/温度发生变化,可能需要重新校准(就像在高速时对DDR存储器设备所做的那样)。
Austin Lesea主要工程师Xilinx San Jose
在原帖中查看解决方案

以上来自于谷歌翻译


以下为原文

Colin,

If you do not care about absolute phase, then there is no problem.

The IBUF, dedicated clock pin route has a controlled, known delay (for the tools), and a general IO pin, using hte regular fabric interconnect will have a delay that varies more, but is really no different in performance, than the dedicated route.

It is true that if you used regular interconnect for all of your clock routing, you could have more jitter, but the short path from IOB to the nearest global buffer access point (or DCM), is not enough of a span to introduce jitter.  By choosing the same resources for the DCM feedback path, you may actually compensate for the variations.  This may require hand placement of hte routes in FPGA_editor, but could provide a better solution (at some cost of time and effort, and future maintainability).
 
You will get a warning, or more than one warning, which you may ignore.
 
The delay will change with process (chip to another chip), voltage, and temperature;  but then, it would do so for the IBUF as well.  The use of the BUFG for the DCM feedback is designed to compensate for this.  If you are not pushing the performance too far, you will be able to choose a fixed delay sampling point.  Otherwise you will have to have a sort of training sequence to find the best spot to sample for each board, and perhaps re-calibrate if the voltage/temperature changes (like what is done for the DDR memory devices at very high speeds).
 
 
Austin Lesea
Principal Engineer
Xilinx San JoseView solution in original post
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潘晶燕

2019-7-26 10:34:39
科林,
如果你不关心绝对阶段,那就没有问题。
IBUF,专用时钟引脚路由具有受控的已知延迟(对于工具),并且使用常规结构互连的通用IO引脚将具有比专用路由更多的延迟,但实际上没有性能差异

确实,如果您使用常规互连进行所有时钟路由,则可能会有更多抖动,但是从IOB到最近的全局缓冲区访问点(或DCM)的短路径不足以引入抖动。
通过为DCM反馈路径选择相同的资源,您实际上可以补偿变化。
这可能需要在FPGA_editor中手动放置hte路由,但可以提供更好的解决方案(需要花费一些时间和精力,以及将来的可维护性)。
您将收到警告或多个警告,您可能会忽略这些警告。
延迟将随着过程(芯片到另一个芯片),电压和温度而变化;
但是,它也会为IBUF做到这一点。
将BUFG用于DCM反馈旨在弥补这一点。
如果您没有将性能推得太远,您将能够选择固定的延迟采样点。
否则,您将需要一种训练序列,以找到每块电路板的最佳采样点,如果电压/温度发生变化,可能需要重新校准(就像在高速时对DDR存储器设备所做的那样)。
Austin Lesea主要工程师Xilinx San Jose

以上来自于谷歌翻译


以下为原文

Colin,

If you do not care about absolute phase, then there is no problem.

The IBUF, dedicated clock pin route has a controlled, known delay (for the tools), and a general IO pin, using hte regular fabric interconnect will have a delay that varies more, but is really no different in performance, than the dedicated route.

It is true that if you used regular interconnect for all of your clock routing, you could have more jitter, but the short path from IOB to the nearest global buffer access point (or DCM), is not enough of a span to introduce jitter.  By choosing the same resources for the DCM feedback path, you may actually compensate for the variations.  This may require hand placement of hte routes in FPGA_editor, but could provide a better solution (at some cost of time and effort, and future maintainability).
 
You will get a warning, or more than one warning, which you may ignore.
 
The delay will change with process (chip to another chip), voltage, and temperature;  but then, it would do so for the IBUF as well.  The use of the BUFG for the DCM feedback is designed to compensate for this.  If you are not pushing the performance too far, you will be able to choose a fixed delay sampling point.  Otherwise you will have to have a sort of training sequence to find the best spot to sample for each board, and perhaps re-calibrate if the voltage/temperature changes (like what is done for the DDR memory devices at very high speeds).
 
 
Austin Lesea
Principal Engineer
Xilinx San Jose
举报

余姗姗

2019-7-26 10:59:14
我做了很多次,使用非gclk引脚作为输入时钟
IMO,从通用IOB到专用缓冲器GBUF的内部路由仍然优于其在PCB上的迹线/段。
-----------
出于某种原因,我的电路板最终会在时钟网络上的zig-zac跟踪进入FPGA ......当我与电路板开发人员交谈时,我得到了“数据和时钟匹配长度”的答案。
但我总是需要校准时钟相位以满足IOB的时序要求

以上来自于谷歌翻译


以下为原文

I do this many times, to use non gclk pin for input clock
 
IMO, the internal routing from general IOB to the dedicate buffer GBUF is still better than the its trace/segments on the PCB.
 
-----------
 
For some reason my boards end up with zig-zac trace on the clock net that feeds into the FPGA... When I talk to the board development's, I've got the answer  for "data & clock matching length" ???  But I always have to calibrate the clock phase to meet timing at the IOB
 
 
 
 
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刘丽

2019-7-26 11:04:17
一个小小的书呆子色情...完成了具有可变增益放大器的ADC板(~10-40dB增益),应该使那个便宜的安富利板便于与现实世界接口!

以上来自于谷歌翻译


以下为原文

A little nerd porn... completed ADC board with variable gain amplifier (~10-40dB gain), should make that cheap Avnet board handy for interfacing with the real world!
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