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我有一个1.8 GHz的HP 4291B射频阻抗/材料分析仪,但有点困惑的是看到开放标准的电容是82 fF,虽然它可以改为任何_constant_值。
换句话说,它*不*支持三阶多项式C(f)= C0 10 ^ -15 ^ + C1 10 ^ -27 ^ f + C2 10 ^ -36 ^ f ^ 2 ^ + C3 10 ^ -45 ^ f ^ 3 ^(f in Hz,C in Farads)1.8 GHz 4291B已经过时,但我查看了更换产品的在线手册(E4991B)并再次看到这个假设开放标准的电容与 频率。 我试图理解为什么会这样,尽管较低频率的VNA支持3 ^ rd ^阶多项式。 我的4291B(P / N 04191-85302)没有一个非常基本的打开,它不能控制夹头的确切位置,因此使用85050B校准套件(85050-80010)打开更好的质量 ),其中电容使用以下多项式计算:C(f)= 90.4799 10 ^ -15 ^ + 763.303 10 ^ -27 ^ f -63.8176 10 ^ -36 ^ f ^ 2 ^ + 6.4337 10 ^ -45 ^ f ^ 3 ^ 1 MHz时的电容为90.48 fF,1.8 GHz时的电容为91.6846 fF。 因此,在1 MHz和1.8 GHz之间存在1.2 fF的变化。 由于没有办法将电容作为多项式输入,我选择了75%的上限频率,假设电容在高频时更为关键。 我宁愿任意选择91.41 fF,这是1350 MHz的值。 我错过了什么? 这对阻抗分析仪而言比VNA要小得多吗? DaveEdited:drkirkby于2016年1月6日下午2:03 以上来自于谷歌翻译 以下为原文 I've got a 1.8 GHz HP 4291B RF Impedance/Material analyzer but was a bit puzzled to see that the capacitance of the open standard was 82 fF, although it can be changed to any _constant_ value. In other words, it does *not* support the 3rd order polynomial C(f) = C0 10 ^-15^ + C1 10 ^-27^ f + C2 10 ^-36^ f ^2^ + C3 10 ^-45^ f ^3^ (f in Hz, C in Farads) The 1.8 GHz 4291B is obsolete, but I checked the online manual for the replacement product (E4991B) and see that again this assumes that the capacitance of the open standard is independent of frequency. I'm trying to understand why this can be so, despite lower frequency VNAs support a 3 ^rd^ order polynomial. I don't have one of the very basic opens for my 4291B (P/N 04191-85302), which does not control the exact position of the collet, so are using the better quality open from an 85050B cal kit (85050-80010), where the capacitance is calculated using the following polynomial: C(f) = 90.4799 10 ^-15^ + 763.303 10 ^-27^ f -63.8176 10 ^-36^ f ^2^ + 6.4337 10 ^-45^ f ^3^ The capacitance is 90.48 fF at 1 MHz and 91.6846 fF at 1.8 GHz. Therefore there's a 1.2 fF variation between 1 MHz and 1.8 GHz. With no way to enter the capacitance as a polynomial, I picked a frequency 75% of the upper limit, on the assumption the capacitance was more critical at high frequencies. I rather arbitrarily picked 91.41 fF, which is the value at 1350 MHz. As I missing something? Is this far less critical on an impedance analyzer than a VNA? Dave Edited by: drkirkby on Jan 6, 2016 2:03 PM |
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那么,如果你正在测量一个电容器,并且你看到从一个频率到另一个频率的1.2 fF的差异,我猜它将你的误差限制在大约,我们看到,1.2 fF ...... 1 pF的0.1%。
也许他们会忽视它,因为它是如此小的影响。 以上来自于谷歌翻译 以下为原文 Well, if you are measuring a capacitor, and you see a difference of 1.2 fF from one frequency to another, I guess it bounds your error to approximately, let's see, 1.2 fF... 0.1 percent of 1 pF. Maybe they ignore it as it is such a small effect. |
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脑洞大赛9 发表于 2018-10-3 10:35 > {quote:title = Dr_joel写道:} {quote}>好吧,如果你正在测量一个电容器,并且你看到从一个频率到另一个频率的差异为1.2 fF,我猜它会将你的误差限制在大约,让我们看看,1.2 fF ... 1 pF的0.1%。 也许他们会忽视它,因为它是如此小的影响。 我举了1.8 GHz分析仪的例子。 在3 GHz E4991B上,C的变化会更高。 您显然觉得8753A上需要包含C随频率的变化,所以它让我感到有些奇怪,阻抗分析仪没有做到这一点,因为它们基本上测量相同类型的参数,尽管方式不同。 我现在开始怀疑85050B / C / D和85031B校准套件的公布系数是否被搞砸了(可能是换位),但这是另一个故事。 戴夫 以上来自于谷歌翻译 以下为原文 > {quote:title=Dr_joel wrote:}{quote} > Well, if you are measuring a capacitor, and you see a difference of 1.2 fF from one frequency to another, I guess it bounds your error to approximately, let's see, 1.2 fF... 0.1 percent of 1 pF. Maybe they ignore it as it is such a small effect. I took the example of my 1.8 GHz analyzer. On a 3 GHz E4991B, the variation of C would be even higher. You obviously felt it desirable on the 8753A to include variation of C with frequency, so it struck me a bit odd the same was not done on the impedance analyzers, as essentially they measure the same sort of parameters, although in a different way. I'm now starting to doubt if the published coefficients for the 85050B/C/D and 85031B cal kits are screwed up (possibly transposed), but that's another story. Dave |
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60user7 发表于 2018-10-3 10:47 同样,阻抗分析仪的差异大约为2 fF(假设误差与频率成比例)。 阻抗分析器通常用于测量非常大或非常小的阻抗,远离50欧姆,而S参数用于测量接近50欧姆。 但是在一天结束时,误差将是2fF,这在阻抗分析领域确实非常小。 以上来自于谷歌翻译 以下为原文 Again, the difference on an impedance analyzer would be about 2 fF (presuming the error scaled with frequency). Impedance analzyers are typically used to measure very large or very small impedances, far from 50 ohms, whereas S-parameters are used to measure near 50 ohms. But at the end of the day, the error would be 2fF which in impedance analysis world, very small indeed. |
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