[问答]

可以使用带有4285A LCR仪表的16453A介电材料夹具吗？

问答对人有帮助，内容完整，我也想知道答案 0 虽然4285A LCR测量仪不支持16453A电介质测试夹具，但是16453A介电材料测试夹具是否可以与4285A LCR测量仪一起使用？我意识到4285A的固件没有直接的支持，但任何人都可以给我任何关于如何校准它们的建议，所以我可以使用一些外部软件来确定电介质的介电常数？我有以下相关部分 - 见一些* 16453A介电材料测试夹具（1 MHz至1 GHz）* 4285A LCR测量仪的图片。（75 kHz至30 MHz）* 16085B 4TP至7mm / APC7适配器。 * 16048A是1米长的BNC电缆，可将4285A的测试端口扩展到4个公头BNC连接器。 * 4 x母 - 母BNC适配器 - 需要，因为16048A具有公连接器，16085B端子适配器也是如此。 * 85050B APC7校准套件。（我还有一个8753ES VNA，如果这对校准有任何帮助）。通过这些组合，我能够：将4285A LCR仪表连接到16453A介电材料测试夹具。我使用以下程序获得合理，但* * 良好的结果，虽然我可以看到为什么这将永远不会非常准确的基本缺陷。 1）在LCR仪表中将电缆长度校正设置为1 m。 2）使用闩锁将16453A介电材料测试夹具的电极分开，然后对4285A LCR测量仪进行开放式校准 - 见图。 3）使16453A介电材料测试夹具的电极短路，并对LCR测量仪进行短暂校准 - 见图。 4）将待测材料（MUT）插入介电测试夹具中 - 照片显示的是一块1.05 mm厚的PTFE。 5）测量LCR仪表上的电容（0.717 pF）6）通过假设电极直径为7 mm来计算电容的介电常数，这是16453A的较小电极的直径。使用一块1.05毫米厚的PTFE，我计算出Er为2.21，这不是一个完全令人难以置信的结果。假设间隙为3.5毫米，电极直径为7毫米，非常快速的计算表明，当执行“开放”校准时，两个电极之间将存在大约0.1 pF的电容。所以真的开放并不是一个非常好的开放。在VNA中，一个人定义了一个开放的电容，但是我没有看到任何方法在4285A中做到这一点。我怀疑对于更薄的样品和更高的介电常数材料，准确度会提高，因为夹具的非理想特性将不那么显着，因为电场将更集中在电介质中。我注意到用于16453A的程序假设使用约0.7 mm的PTFE作为负载校准标准，并将厚度输入其中一个支持的阻抗分析仪，但这对我来说没什么用处，因为我没有任何这些分析仪。我已经考虑过尝试使用有限元程序对夹具进行建模以计算电容的可能性，尽管我认为用于与上电极滑动连接的小“手指”可能使得实际上不可能做好工作。我可以想出一种方法可以让我准确测量“开放”的边缘电容，但我仍然不知道如何使用它来改善LCR仪表的夹具校准。将带有APC7连接器的电缆连接到8753ES VNA 使用85050B APC7校准套件校准VNA 在16453A的底部电极之间做一个低电感短路，并使用VNA上的端口扩展来获得180°的相位度删除低电感短路，VNA应该向我显示边缘电容，但我不认为它太精确，因为VNA在非常高的阻抗下不能很好地工作。这有什么意义吗？我知道简单的答案是购买16453A支持的阻抗分析仪，但这些都非常昂贵，而我同时拥有4285A和8753ES。 DaveEdited：drkirkby于2015年3月29日9:41 PM 16453A-电介质夹具与1mm-PTFE夹在两个电极之间.jpg828.8 KBshort-calibration.jpg981.6 KB3-main-components .jpg451.8 KB 以上来自于谷歌翻译以下为原文 Whilst the 16453A dielectric test fixture is not supported with the 4285A LCR meter, is there any way the 16453A dielectric material test fixture could be used with the 4285A LCR meter? I realize that there is no direct support in the 4285A's firmware, but can anyone give me any advice on how it might be possible to calibrate them, so I can use some external software to determine the permittivity of a dielectric? I have the following relevant parts - see picture of some 16453A Dielectric Material Test Fixture (1 MHz to 1 GHz) * 4285A LCR meter. (75 kHz to 30 MHz) * 16085B 4TP to 7mm/APC7 adapter. * 16048A which are 1 m BNC cables that extend the 4285A's test ports to 4 male BNC connectors. * 4 x female-female BNC adapters - needed because the 16048A has male connectors, as does the 16085B terminal adapter. * 85050B APC7 calibration kit. (I also have an 8753ES VNA, if that would be any help in a calibration). With that combination of parts I am able to: connect the 4285A LCR meter to the 16453A dielectric material test fixture. I achieved reasonable, but NOT good results using the following procedure, although I can see fundamental flaws why this will never be very accurate. 1) Set the cable length correction to 1 m in the LCR meter. 2) Separated the electrodes of the 16453A dielectric material test fixture, using the latch, then performed an open calibration of the 4285A LCR meter - see photo. 3) Shorted the electrodes of the 16453A dielectric material test fixture and performed a short calibration of the LCR meter - see photo. 4) Inserted the material under test (MUT) into the dielectric test fixture - the photo shows a piece of PTFE which is 1.05 mm thick. 5) Measured the capacitance on the LCR meter (0.717 pF) 6) Computed the dielectric constant from the capacitance by assuming an electrode diameter of 7 mm, which is what the diameter of the smaller electrode of 16453A. Using a piece of 1.05 mm thick PTFE I calculated Er to be 2.21, which is not a totally unbelievable result. A very quick calculation, assuming a 3.5 mm gap and a 7 mm diameter electrode, would suggest that approximately 0.1 pF of capacitance would be present between the two electrodes when the "open" calibration is performed. So really the open is not really a very good open. In a VNA, one defined the capacitance of an open, but I don't see any way to do this in the 4285A. I suspect the accuracy would improve for thinner samples and higher permittivity materials, as then the non-ideal characteristics of the fixture would be less significant, as the E-field would be more concentrated in the dielectric. I note the procedure one is supposed to use with the 16453A involves using about 0.7 mm of PTFE as a load calibration standard, and entering the thickness into one of the supported impedance analyzers, but that is not much use to me, as I don't have any of those analyzers. I have considered the possibility of trying to model the fixture with a finite element program to compute the capacitance, although the little "fingers" which I think are used to make a sliding connection to the upper electrode probably make it practically impossible to do a good job. I can think of a way which may allow me to get an accurate measurement of the fringing capacitance of the "open", but I've still not no idea how I could use it to improve the calibration of the fixture with the LCR meter. * Connect a cable with an APC7 connector to the 8753ES VNA * Calibrate the VNA with the 85050B APC7 calibration kit * Make a low-inductance short between the bottom electrode of the 16453A and use a port extension on the VNA to get a phase of 180 degrees * Remove the low inductance short, and the VNA should show me the fringing capacitance, but I don't think it would be too accurate, as VNAs don't work too well at very high impedances. Does any of this make sense? I know the simple answer is to buy an impedance analyzer supported by the 16453A, but these are all quite expensive, whereas I have both the 4285A and the 8753ES. Dave Edited by: drkirkby on Mar 29, 2015 9:41 PM 附件 open-calibration.jpg998.5 KB 16453A-dielectric-fixture-with-1mm-PTFE-sandwiched-between-the-two-electrodes.jpg828.8 KB short-calibration.jpg981.6 KB 3-main-components.jpg451.8 KB 0
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答案对人有帮助，有参考价值 0 令人遗憾的是16453A专用于4291A / B，E4991A和新的E4991B，仅带有材料测量固件。它与任何其他仪器不兼容。需要固件来执行测试夹具补偿并补偿无保护平行电极的边缘电容效应的介电常数测量值。如果没有固件，16453A无法用于介电常数/磁导率测量。请参阅以下常见问题解答：http：//www.keysight.com/main/editorial.jspx？cc = MY＆amp; cs = eng＆amp; ckey = 1387787＆amp; nid = -536902475.536879638＆amp; id = 1387787您可以参考表3 以下URL中的开路/短路阻抗指南的16453A操作和维修手册中的-4（第3-6页）：http：//literature.cdn.keysight.com/litweb/pdf/16453-90010.pdf 以上来自于谷歌翻译以下为原文 Regretfully the 16453A dedicated to 4291A/B, E4991A and the new E4991B with material measurement firmware only. It is not compatible with any other instruments. The firmware is required to perform the test fixture compensation and compensate the permittivity measurement values for the fringe capacitance effects of the unguarded parallel electrodes. Without the firmware, the 16453A cannot serve for the permittivity/ permeability measurements. Please refer to the following FAQ: http://www.keysight.com/main/editorial.jspx?cc=MY&lc=eng&ckey=1387787&nid=-536902475.536879638&id=1387787 You may refer to Table 3-4 (page3-6) of the 16453A Operation and Service Manual for the Open/Short impedance guideline in the following URL: http://literature.cdn.keysight.com/litweb/pdf/16453-90010.pdf

2018-10-15 11:32:54 评论举报张秀珍