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我有一个8720D(50 MHz到20 GHz),并且想知道是否有任何方法可以通过使用外部耦合器,混频器等将频率范围降低到1 MHz或更低。我对此并不感到困扰
动态范围或准确度下降。 我主要对天线的反射测量感兴趣,所以测量S11在最坏的情况下是可以接受的,但是当然能够测量所有4个S参数会很好。 我知道通过使用外部设备可以将VNA的频率范围扩展到mm波,但我所看到的只需要一个可配置的测试装置。 问题是,除了测试端口之外,我对此VNA内部信号路径的唯一访问是后* R通道上的* 10 MHz参考输入,它被买到前面板。 后部的10 MHz参考输入意味着信号发生器,VNA可以具有相同的10 MHz参考。 我想通过使用200 MHz本地振荡器和混频器将VNA用作200-250 MHz范围内的可调谐IF。 在该频率下,图像响应应比VNA工作在GHz频率时更容易滤波。 8720D的动态范围在50 MHz时比在较高频率下低,因此我认为在200-250 MHz左右工作可能是明智的。 考虑到对内部信号路径的访问相当有限,我对这是多么实用有任何想法? 有没有人得到一个已知有效的方块图? 戴夫 以上来自于谷歌翻译 以下为原文 I've got an 8720D (50 MHz to 20 GHz), and are wondering if there is any way I can drop the frequency range down to 1 MHz or less by using external couplers, mixers etc. I'm not too bothered about a drop in dynamic range or accuracy. I'm mainly interested in reflection measurements on antennas, so just measuring S11 would at a worst case be acceptable, though being able to measure all 4 S parameters would be nice of course. I know the frequency range of VNAs can be extended up to mm wave by the use of external devices, but all that I have seen require a configurable test set. The problem is, apart from the test ports, the only access I have to this VNA internal signal paths are * 10 MHz reference input on rear * R channel which is bought out to the front panel. The 10 MHz reference input on the rear means a signal generator and VNA could have the same 10 MHz reference. I was thinking of perhaps using the VNA as a tunable IF in the range of say 200-250 MHz, by use of a 200 MHz local oscillator and mixer. At that frequency, the image responses should be easier to filter than if the VNA was working at GHz frequencies. The dynamic range of the 8720D is lower at 50 MHz than at higher frequencies, so I was thinking working around 200-250 MHz might be sensible. Any thoughts on how practical this is, given the rather limited access I have to the internal signal paths? Has anyone got a block diagram of something that is known to work? Dave |
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6个回答
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> {quote:title = Dr_joel写道:} {quote}>简而言之。 不,什么是*最低限度*需要什么才能使用? 背面标有“TEST SET I / O INTERCONNECT”的25针DIN连接器。 虽然手册说这是未使用的,但用DVM探测我可以看到实际上有一条信号线从0变为5 V,因为前面的LED从端口1移动到端口2.所以看起来开关位置 信息是可用的,即使不是正式的。 那就够了吗? 如果我能直接访问A和B接收器怎么样? 上次我看到,大多数可以访问A和B接收器的部件都可以从安捷伦获得,但一条2.4毫米到SMA的电缆除外。 因此,将接收器添加到前面板的选项012是可行的。 实际上从Keysight购买选项012的位数比购买低成本的VWNA要花费更多,但我更倾向于使用我的8720D,如果技术上可行,我会热衷于降低它。 戴夫 以上来自于谷歌翻译 以下为原文 > {quote:title=Dr_joel wrote:}{quote} > in short. No. What is the *bare minimum* one would need to get something to work? There's a 25 pin DIN connector on the back marked "TEST SET I/O INTERCONNECT". Whilst the manual says this is unused, poking around with a DVM I can see there is a actually a signal line which changes from 0 to 5 V as the LEDs on the front move from port 1 to port 2. So it seems the switch position information is available, even if not officially. Would that be enough? How about if I could get direct access to the A and B receivers too? Last time I looked, most of the parts to get access to the A and B receivers were available from Agilent, with the exception of one 2.4 mm to SMA cable. So adding option 012, which brings the receivers to the front panel, is doable. Actually buying the bits for option 012 from Keysight would cost more than buying the low-cost VWNA, but I am rather attached to my 8720D, and would be keen to get it down a bit if this is technically possible. Dave |
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60user7 发表于 2018-11-14 06:52 扩展VNA的频率范围(旧型号和新型号)需要硬件和软件的组合,所以即使你能以某种方式为8720D的低频版本获得所有正确的硬件组件,盒子中的固件也不会 不能识别你的变化而你实际上无法在较低频率下操作它。 使用外部硬件扩展现有VNA频率范围的一个例子是我们的基于PNA的mmw系统甚至是8510 XF(110 GHz)。 这两个系统都采用外部混合头和直接IF访问来扩展VNA的上限频率,但在这两种情况下,如果不对固件进行更改,额外的硬件将完全无用。 所以乔尔博士说“总之,不” 以上来自于谷歌翻译 以下为原文 extending the frequency range of the VNA (the old and the new models) takes a combination of hardware and software, so even if you could somehow get all the right hardware components for a lower frequency version of an 8720D, the firmware in the box wouldn't recognize your changes and you couldn't actually operate it at the lower frequencies. An example of extending the frequency range of an existing VNA with external hardware is our PNA based mmw systems or even the 8510 XF (110 GHz). both these systems take external mixing heads and direct IF access to extend the upper frequency bounds of the VNA, but in both cases, without the changes we made to the firmware, the additional hardware would be completely useless. So as Dr. Joel said "in short, no" |
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即使我们假设理想的硬件,我在这个框图中看到的一个问题是你只是用A接收器重新采样新的频率(20 MHz)。 您的参考接收器R1仍在测量220 MHz的信号,因此在校准时,您正在以20 MHz的频率激励您的校准标准,但将该校正归因于在220 MHz下测量的参考跟踪项。 因此,即使你能找到重新定义calkit标准的正确方法,你总是要测量不同频率下的A / R1比率,并假设混频器1的引入和外部200 MHz LO没有影响 关于参考信号的幅度和相位。 但这是一个足够简单的框图,您可以尝试将其与实际的较低频率VNA进行比较,看看是否得到了相同的答案。 以上来自于谷歌翻译 以下为原文 even if we assume ideal hardware, the one problem I see in this block diagram is that you are only re-sampling the the new frequency (20 MHz) with the A receiver. Your reference receiver R1 is still measuring a signal at 220 MHz, so when you are calibrating, you are stimulating your calibration standard at 20 MHz, but attributing that correction to a reference tracking term measured at 220 MHz. So, even if you could figure out the correct way of redefining the calkit standards, you are always going to measure the A/R1 ratios at different frequencies and will be assuming that the introduction of mixer 1 and the external 200 MHz LO has no impact on the magnitude and phase of the reference signal. But this is a simple enough block diagram that you could potentially try it out and compare the result to an actual lower frequency VNA and see if you get the same answer. |
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是的,这样做。 虽然,您可以使用另一个定向耦合器而不是分路器(通过路径损耗更少)。 你仍然需要伪造校准系数,但它可能会起作用。 祝你好运。 以上来自于谷歌翻译 以下为原文 yes that would do it. Although, you could just use another directional coupler instead of the splitter (less loss in the thru path). you still have to fake the calibration coefficients, but it might work. Best of luck. |
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> {quote:title = daras写道:} {quote}>是的,这样做。 虽然,您可以使用另一个定向耦合器而不是分路器(通过路径损耗更少)。 你仍然需要伪造校准系数,但它可能会起作用。 >>祝你好运。 谢谢Dara(我假设你是Joel书中提到的Dara)。 我试一试。 我有一个Mini电路位的集合,它们可能足以尝试它,尽管它们不是最佳的。 实际上我的*需要*已经大大减少,因为我刚买了一个二手N3383A PNA(300 kHz到9 GHz,3端口)。 但我仍然会尝试一下。 PNA降至300 kHz,至少给了我一些测试它的能力。 戴夫 以上来自于谷歌翻译 以下为原文 > {quote:title=daras wrote:}{quote} > yes that would do it. Although, you could just use another directional coupler instead of the splitter (less loss in the thru path). you still have to fake the calibration coefficients, but it might work. > > Best of luck. Thank you Dara (I assume you are the Dara mentioned in Joel's book). I'll give it a try. I have a collection of Mini circuits bits that are probably good enough to try it, although they would not be optimal. Actually my *need* for this has dropped considerably, as I have just bought a used N3383A PNA (300 kHz to 9 GHz, 3 port). But I am still going to try it out. The PNA, which goes down to 300 kHz,.at least gives me someth8ing to test it against. Dave |
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