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李青

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[问答]

VNA上的TDR选项是否可用于开发窄带天线?

建模和测试Yagi-Uda(或大多数人称之为Yagi)天线的主题是业余无线电邮件列表中非常常见的主题。
这些是窄带,带宽通常为中心频率的1-2%。
然后,我知道VNA的TDR选项是否可以告诉任何有关这种天线的信息。
对IEEE期刊的快速检查表明,我不是第一个考虑使用VNA的TDR选项进行天线表征的人,但我发现的论文都是宽带天线,而不是像Yagi-Uda这样的窄带天线。
我决定在月球网邮件列表上发布这个想法 - 对于对地球 - 月球 - 地球通信感兴趣的业余爱好者。
一个火腿写道,这是他在年龄见过的最发人深省的想法,另一个(雷夫,SM5BZ),谁是世界上最聪明的火腿之一,认为这是行不通的,作为八木的辐射模式改变
迅速的频率。
然后看一下安捷伦的一些论文,以及乔尔博士的头衔,建议TDR功能在窄带滤波器上很有用,所以再一次让我想到了这个带的天线。
不管怎样,我很欣赏这里的大师们的想法。
BTW乔尔,如果你读到这个,你是不是像我一样来自英国?
我找到了你的博士学位,这是在利兹大学完成的,所以我想知道你是不是来自这里。
戴夫,G8WRB。

以上来自于谷歌翻译


     以下为原文

  The subject of modeling and testing Yagi-Uda (or as most people call them Yagi) antennas is a very common topic on amateur radio mailing lists. These are narrow band, with a bandwidth usually of 1-2% of the centre frequency.  

I then had the idea of whether the TDR option of a VNA could tell one anything useful about such an antenna.   A quick check of IEEE journals showed I was not the first person to think of using the TDR option of a VNA for antenna characterisation, but the papers I found were all on wide-band antennas, not narrow band ones like the Yagi-Uda.  

I decided to post this idea on the moon-net mailing list - for amateur interested in earth-moon-earth communications.  

One ham wrote this was the most thought-provoking idea he had seen in ages, yet another (Leif, SM5BZ), who is one of the brightest hams in the world, thought this would not work, as the radiation pattern of an Yagi changes rapidly with frequency.  

Then looking at some of the Agilent's papers, and the title of Joel's Ph.D, suggested the TDR function has been useful on narrow band filters, so once again it got me thinking about the narrorw band antennas.  

Anway, I'd appreciate the thoughts on the gurus on here.   

BTW Joel, if you read this, are you from the UK like myself? I found a reference to your Ph.D, which was done at Leeds university, so I wondered if you were from here.  

Dave, G8WRB.  

回帖(5)

陈建华

2019-4-12 15:29:12
我们的乔尔博士住在加利福尼亚州的塞瓦斯托波尔...在旧金山北部约一小时,在索诺玛县,在圣罗莎的安捷伦工厂附近。
他不是来自英国。
利兹大学(去年去世)的Roger Pollard博士是他在夏季安捷伦休假期间的博士生导师和同事。
但如果您购买了他的新书* +微波元件测量手册+ *(请参阅致谢页面),您就会知道这一切。我建议您立即购买!
它在亚马逊上。
:-)编辑:jvall于2013年1月10日下午12:10

以上来自于谷歌翻译


     以下为原文

  Our Dr Joel lives in Sebastopol, CA...about an hour North of San Francisco, in Sonoma County, and near the Agilent factory in Santa Rosa.  He is not from the UK.
Dr Roger Pollard at University of Leeds (who passed away last year), was his Ph.D adviser and colleague during his summer sabbaticals at Agilent.

But you would know all this if you bought his new book *+Handbook of Microwave Component  Measurements+*  (see Acknowledgments page.)

I suggest you purchase this immediately!  It is on Amazon.   :-)

Edited by: jvall on Jan 10, 2013 12:10 PM
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李青

2019-4-12 15:38:52
引用: 胡bbs2 发表于 2019-4-12 15:29
我们的乔尔博士住在加利福尼亚州的塞瓦斯托波尔...在旧金山北部约一小时,在索诺玛县,在圣罗莎的安捷伦工厂附近。
他不是来自英国。
利兹大学(去年去世)的Roger Pollard博士是他在夏季安捷伦休假期间的博士生导师和同事。

> {quote:title = jvall写道:} {quote}>我们的Joel博士住在加利福尼亚州的Sebastopol ...距旧金山北部约一小时车程,靠近Santa Rosa的安捷伦工厂。
我知道,但乔尔可能不会在美国出生和/或学习。
我找到了应用笔记1287-12“使用网络分析仪进行时域分析”其中一个参考文献是:[4] Dunsmore,Joel Phillip。,+耦合谐振器滤波器的时域响应以及应用于调谐+,博士论文
,利兹大学,2004所以我想知道乔尔是否获得了他的博士学位。
这里是英国利兹大学。
>但你会知道,如果你买了他的书* +微波元件测量手册+ *。
>我建议你现在就这样做!
它在亚马逊上。
:-)我的购买没有多大意义,因为我已经购买了一份*!
查看亚马逊英国“DR Kirkby”(亚马逊已验证购买者)的评论:http://www.amazon.co.uk/Handbook-Microwave-Component-Measurements-Techniques/dp/1119979552没有奖品可用于猜测评论是通过
我。
顺便说一句,虽然我的用户名在这里是“drkirkby”,但我在1999年获得博士学位之前就习惯使用该用户名。“D。R.”
也是我的首字母!
因此我在亚马逊上的首字母。
关于TDR的部分在Joel的书上是相当大的事实,而且他似乎完成了他的博士学位。
在过滤器上,让我觉得他可能知道TDR是否适用于窄带天线。
戴夫

以上来自于谷歌翻译


     以下为原文

  > {quote:title=jvall wrote:}{quote}
> Our Dr Joel lives in Sebastopol, CA...about an hour North of San Francisco and near the Agilent Factory in Santa Rosa.

I know that, but Joel might not have been born and/or studied in the USA. 

I found the application note 1287-12  "Time Domain Analysis Using a Network Analyzer" One of the references is:

[4] Dunsmore, Joel Phillip., +The time-domain response of coupled-resonator filters with applications to tuning+, PhD Thesis, University of Leeds, 2004

So I wondered if Joel did his Ph.D. here in the UK at the University of Leeds. 

> But you would know that if you bought his book *+Handbook of Microwave Component  Measurements+*.
> I suggest you do that now!  It is on Amazon.   :-)

There's not much much point in my buying it, as I have *already purchased a copy*! See the review by "D. R. Kirkby" (Amazon Verified Purchaser) on Amazon UK:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Handbook-Microwave-Component-Measurements-Techniques/dp/1119979552

No prizes for guessing that review is by me. 

BTW, although my user name on here is "drkirkby", I used to use that username well before I got my Ph.D back in 1999. "D. R." are my initials too! Hence my initials on Amazon. 

The fact the section on TDR is quite big on Joel's book, and the fact he appears to done his Ph.D. on filters, made me think he might know if TDR is applicable to narrow band antennas. 

Dave
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刘华湘

2019-4-12 15:56:07
引用: 60user7 发表于 2019-4-12 15:38
> {quote:title = jvall写道:} {quote}>我们的Joel博士住在加利福尼亚州的Sebastopol ...距旧金山北部约一小时车程,靠近Santa Rosa的安捷伦工厂。
我知道,但乔尔可能不会在美国出生和/或学习。
我找到了应用笔记1287-12“使用网络分析仪进行时域分析”其中一个参考文献是:[4] Dunsmore,Joel Phillip。,+耦合谐振器滤 ...

由于安捷伦与波拉德博士和利兹大学的良好关系,我们的一些工程师在那里(远程)完成了他们的博士学位,但正如合资公司指出的那样,Dr_Joel和Apple Pie一样美国,但我知道他第一手
享受一品脱以及任何英国主题:-)事实上,下次你在其中一次会议上遇到他并希望了解更多有关TDR的信息时,给他买一品脱或者一品脱将是最简单的启蒙之路,干杯,

以上来自于谷歌翻译


     以下为原文

  Because of the great relationship Agilent had with Dr. Pollard and Leeds University, a number of our engineers did their PhD work there (remotely), but as JV pointed out, Dr_Joel is as American as Apple Pie, but I know first hand that he enjoys a pint as well as any British subject :-)  In fact next time you run into him at one of the conferences and want to know more about TDR, buying him a pint or two would be the easiest path to enlightenment

Cheers,
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李青

2019-4-12 16:13:30
引用: Topcbpcba 发表于 2019-4-12 15:56
由于安捷伦与波拉德博士和利兹大学的良好关系,我们的一些工程师在那里(远程)完成了他们的博士学位,但正如合资公司指出的那样,Dr_Joel和Apple Pie一样美国,但我知道他第一手
享受一品脱以及任何英国主题:-)事实上,下次你在其中一次会议上遇到他并希望了解更多有关TDR的信息时,给他买一品脱或者一品脱将是最简单的启 ...

> {quote:title = daras写道:} {quote}>由于安捷伦与Pollard博士和利兹大学的良好关系,我们的一些工程师在那里(远程)完成了他们的博士学位,好吧,这就解释了利兹
链接然后。
如果你有一个好雇主,我想这可能是一个博士学位的好方法。
>但正如合资公司所指出的那样,Dr_Joel和Apple Pie一样美国,这在这里也很常见!
>但我知道他喜欢品脱以及任何英国主题:-)事实上,下次你在其中一次会议上遇到他并希望了解更多有关TDR的信息时,给他买一品脱或者一品脱将是
最简单的启蒙之路在这个论坛上见到他或者其他任何一组乐于助人的安捷伦员工都会很愉快。
它不太可能在不久的将来参加会议,因为我目前失业,收入正好为零。
刚才找工作和/或赚钱是另一回事。
BTW,这是一个完全奇怪的问题。
你知道VNA是否是安捷伦出售的最昂贵的产品吗?
我知道安捷伦最昂贵的VNA不仅仅是安捷伦最昂贵的DVM,但我想知道是否还有比VNA更昂贵的测试设备。
戴夫

以上来自于谷歌翻译


     以下为原文

  > {quote:title=daras wrote:}{quote}
> Because of the great relationship Agilent had with Dr. Pollard and Leeds University, a number of our engineers did their PhD work there (remotely), 
OK, so that explains the Leeds link then. I guess that can be a good way to do a Ph.D if you have a good employer. 
> but as JV pointed out, Dr_Joel is as American as Apple Pie,
That's pretty common here too! 
>  but I know first hand that he enjoys a pint as well as any British subject :-)  In fact next time you run into him at one of the conferences and want to know more about TDR, buying him a pint or two would be the easiest path to enlightenment
It would be nice to meet him - or any of the other of group of helpful Agilent staff on this forum. It's unlikely to be at a conference in the near future, as I'm currently unemployed, with an income of precisely zero. Getting a job, and/or earning money another way is a bit more important just now. 
  
BTW, as a totally odd question. Do you know if VNAs are the most expensive items Agilent sell? I know Agilent's most expensive VNA is more than Agilent's most expensive DVM, but I wonder if there are other more expensive bits of test equipment than VNAs.  

Dave
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