PNA X Win7校准

HI rok，检查噪音调谐器路径开关。
出于某种原因，在7中它默认为外部。
我相信这可以在系统选项菜单中更改。
我发现有用的东西是机械设备窗口，它会显示通道之间的这些差异。
从下拉菜单，Trace / Chan> Channel> Mechanical设备。
此外，可以在路径配置窗口中设置此路径。
希望这可以帮助。
Regards编辑：rfelectek于2015年3月5日下午3:37



     以下为原文

  HI rok,

Check noise tuner path switch. For some reason in 7 it defaults to external. I believe this can be changed in the system options menu. Something I have found useful is the mechanical devices window that will show you these kind of differences between channels. From pull down menu, Trace/Chan > Channel > Mechanical devices. Also, this path can be set in path configuration window. Hope this helps.

Regards

Edited by: rfelectek on Mar 5, 2015 3:37 PM

我有几分钟，很好奇，所以我下载并将你的.CSA加载到我的PNAX上。
我确认噪声调谐器路径开关在一个通道中设置为外部，在另一个通道内部设置为内部。
你有选择-029（或者，如果年纪大了，H29），对吧？
是的，这也会影响SMC测量类。
您正在将单个校准应用于两种不同的硬件配置，这将解释不同的结果。
一旦硬件配置相同（切换噪声调谐器路径开关），您应该在两个通道中获得相同的结果。
作为一项规则，我希望始终将噪声调谐器开关设置为内部，因为我不使用噪声调谐器（额外的E-cal模块），并且通过外部环路的路径损耗更大。
比在内部路径。
我真的不明白为什么默认设置这个外部路径，并希望将来改变它以避免这些类型的问题。
一旦你知道这不是什么大不了的事情，但是直到你弄明白才能引起头痛。编辑：rfelectek于2015年3月5日下午5:54



     以下为原文

  I had a few minutes and was curious so I downloaded and loaded your .CSA onto my PNAX.  I confirmed that the noise tuner path switch is set to external in one channel and internal on the other. you have opt -029(or, if older, H29), right? Yes, this affects SMC measurement class too. You are applying a single calibration to two different hardware configurations, that would explain the different results. Once the hardware configuration is the same(toggle the noise tuner path switch), you should get the same result in both channels. As a rule here, I want to always have the noise tuner switch set to internal as I do not use a noise tuner (extra E-cal module) and the path loss is greater through the external loop. than in the internal path. 

I don't really understand why this external path would be set by default and would hope this is changed in the future to avoid these type of problems. It's not that big a deal once you know but can cause headaches until you figure it out..

Edited by: rfelectek on Mar 5, 2015 5:54 PM

你好，谢谢你的回复。
我会尝试一下，看看它是否有效。
但是，在我描述的第一个使用场景中，两个csa文件中的两个通道都是在win-xp non Opt 29配置上创建的。
但是当我将cal应用于两者时，它只在我校准的通道上正常工作，而不是另一个应该相同的通道。
我只为实验目的创建了额外的win7版本的频道。
我明天测试时会发布结果。
谢谢，rok



     以下为原文

  Hi,

Thanks for the reply. I'll try it out and see if it works. However, in the first usage scenario I described, both channels in both csa files were created on the win-xp non Opt 29 configuration. But when I applied the cal to both, it only worked properly on the channel on which I calibrated on and not the other one which should be identical.  I only created the additional win7 version of the channel for experimentation purposes. I'll post the results when I test tomorrow.

Thanks,
rok

嗨再次，我检查了不同基于XP的csa文件的噪声路径设置，实际上它们之间存在不匹配。
1个文件将所有通道设置为“调谐器”模式，而另一个文件将所有通道设置为“旁路模式”。
这很奇怪，因为除NFX测量通道外，每个文件还包含各种不同的测量类，如S参数，SMC，IMC和IMDX通道。
因此我不确定导入旧的XP生成的.csa文件是否存在问题，以及为什么某些XP csa文件的噪声调谐器路径模式设置为“调谐器”或“旁路”以包含其中包含的所有通道。
附件是这种行为的例子。
opt-02文件将所有通道设置为“旁路”模式。
opt-03文件将所有通道设置为“调谐器”模式。
两者都是在基于XP的系统上创建的。
我发现的第二个问题是使用选项28创建的基于XP的NFX通道，仅使用NA接收器。
当那些“导入”到Windows 7固件中时，这些通道的噪声路径开关始终设置为“噪声接收器”路径而不是“正常”路径，尽管在激励设置中，'NA接收器
'选项已被选中。
到目前为止，我在Win7固件版本A.10.25.02上加载的所有XP文件都发生了这种情况。
所以我相信这是一个可重复的错误。
如果来自Agilent / Keysight的人员可以解决这些问题，那将非常感激。
rokEdited by：rok on 2015年3月6日下午7:46
opt-02校准10-30-2014.csa329.6 KB



     以下为原文

  Hi again,

I checked the noise path settings for the different XP based csa files in question and indeed there was a mismatch between them. 1 file had all the channels set to 'Tuner' mode, while the other file had all the channels set to 'Bypass Mode'. This is odd, since each file contained a variety of different measurement classes such as S Parameter, SMC, IMC, and IMDX channels, in addition to the NFX measurement channel. So I'm not sure if it is an issue with importing old XP generated .csa files and why certain XP csa files have their noise tuner path mode set to either 'Tuner' or 'Bypass' for all the channels contained within.

Attached are examples of this behavior. opt-02 file has all the channels set to 'Bypass' mode. opt-03 file has all the channels set to 'tuner' mode. Both were created on XP based systems. 

The second issue I found was for XP based NFX channels created with the option 28, using only the NA receivers. When those were "imported" into the Windows 7 firmware, the noise path switch for those channels were always set to the 'Noise Receiver' path instead of the 'Normal' path, despite the fact that in the stimulus settings, the 'NA receiver' option was selected. This happened on all the XP files I've loaded on the Win7 firmware version A.10.25.02 so far. So I believe it's a repeatable bug. 

If someone from Agilent/Keysight can address these issues, that would be greatly appreciated.
rok

Edited by: rok on Mar 6, 2015 7:46 PM

附件

• opt-03 Calibration 10-30-2014.csa330.4 KB
  
• opt-02 Calibration 10-30-2014.csa329.6 KB
  

我把你的评论转发给了一个知道男人的人...至于噪音调谐器开关，默认情况下也可能会改变你是否有内部或外部噪音调谐器（新的50 GHz 029有一个内部调谐器）。
切换到外部路径（将调谐器置于H29和26 GHz 029的路径中）的默认设置是这样设置的，因此使用带有扩展测试集的PNA（链接到循环）的客户将默认具有正确的行为
。
但是我做了大量的噪声数字测量，我厌倦了手动绕过噪声调谐器，因此我强制添加“偏好”以强制默认调谐器开关。
一旦设置了首选项（以及所有首选项），它就会进入注册表并通过预设，召回进行保存，可能会在重新安装FW时重置。
当我们改变一个行为（有时是为了修复不良行为）时会添加首选项，但是想要提供一种让盒子像以前一样工作的方法，这样编程就不必改变了（有时编程也是为了解决不良行为）
）。
即使您具有偏好设置，也适用于非噪声通道。
如果您创建新的噪声通道，它将始终将开关设置为噪声设置。
如果从只有028的盒子中调用状态，在029的盒子上，噪声和调谐器开关状态是未定义的。
但是，如果你问我们，我想我们会告诉你“不是一个BUG”，因为我不会真的支持从一个硬件集调用仪器状态到另一个硬件集。



     以下为原文

  I forwarded on your comment to a guy who knows a guy...

As to the noise tuner switch, the default might also change whether you have an internal or external noise tuner (new 50 GHz 029 have an internal tuner). 

The default to switch to the external path (which puts the tuner in the path for H29 and 26 GHz 029) was set that way so that customers using PNA's with extension test sets (which link into the loops) would have the correct behaviour by default. But I was doing lots of noise figure meauserments and I got tired of bypassing the noise tuner manually so I coerced the addtion of a "Preference" to force the tuner switch by default.  Once the preference is set (and all preferences) it goes into the registry and saves through presets, recalls, maybe it get reset on reinstalling FW.  Preferences are added when we change a behavior (sometimes to fix bad behavior) but want to provide a way to have the box work as it did before so that programming doesn't have to change (sometimes the programming was also to work around bad behavior).

Even if you have the preference set, it is for non-noise channels. If you create a new noise channel it will always set the switch to the noise settings.

If you recall a state from a box with only 028, onto a box with 029, the noise and tuner switch states are un-defined.  But, if you ask us, I think we will tell you "NOT A BUG" because I don't we don't offically support recalling instrument states from one hardware set to another.

嗨乔尔博士，谢谢你的回复。
我们的新型Win-7 PNA-X具有内部ecal tunertuner，以及Option 29 Noise figure功能。
正如代表向我传达的那样，Opt 29包括Opt 28的所有功能;
这就是为什么我们不需要单独购买Opt 28和Opt 29。
可能在某些情况下我们需要选择28功能（即测试超过50GHz的噪声系数）。
因此，它仅适用于噪声系数测量类，如果我正在调用选择28配置的噪声系数通道设置为在“激励”设置中使用“NA接收器（端口2）”接收器（无论它是否最初创建
在基于win 7的Opt 29 PNA-X系统的XP或Win7或非硬件噪声系统系统上，我希望噪声路径配置'端口2噪声接收器开关'设置与'刺激'中设置的匹配
设置 - 即设置为'Normal'而不是'Noise Receiver'，而不是默认为'Noise Receiver'。
如果您正在创建一个全新的噪声系数通道，那么它当然应该默认为“噪声接收器”，用于“激励”和“噪声路径配置”。
我的问题是'刺激'和'噪声路径配置'设置之间的不匹配。
哪个优先？
（刺激或噪声路径配置？）不知何故，它们应该以某种方式同步，当它在1个对话框中被改变时，它应该反映在另一个中，反之亦然。
否则，我将不得不改变最初在Opt 28 Win XP PNA-X上创建的每个噪声系数通道，以修复设置之间的不匹配。
至于非噪声系数通道，如下所述，由于这些噪声系数相关的字段不可用，这就解释了在调用csa文件时噪声调谐器开关设置的随机行为。
我会考虑设置您的偏好，因为您建议查看是否可以解决我的问题。
谢谢，rok



     以下为原文

  Hi Dr Joel,

Thanks for the reply. Our new Win-7 PNA-Xs do have the internal ecal tunertuner, as well as Option 29 Noise figure capability. As it was communicated to me from the rep, Opt 29 includes all the capabilities of Opt 28; that is why we don't need to purchase both Opt 28 and Opt 29 separately. There might be certain instances where we would need opt 28 capability (i.e. testing noise figure beyond 50GHz). So as it pertains to the noise figure measurement class only, if I am recalling an opt 28 configured noise figure channel set to use the 'NA Receiver(Port 2)' receiver in the 'Stimulus' settings (regardless of whether it was initially created on an XP or Win7 or non hardware noise figure system) on a win 7 based Opt 29 PNA-X system, I would expect that the noise path configuration 'Port 2 Noise Receiver Switch' setting  to match what is set in the 'Stimulus' settings -- namely set to 'Normal' instead of 'Noise Receiver', rather than default to 'Noise Receiver'. If you're creating a brand new noise figure channel, then of course, it should default to 'Noise Receiver' for both the 'Stimulus' and the 'Noise Path Configuration'. My issue is the mismatch between the 'Stimulus' and the 'Noise Path Configuration' settings. Which would take precedence? (Stimulus or Noise Path configuration?) Somehow, they should be synchronized somehow that when it is changed in 1 dialog, it should be reflected in the other and vice versa. Otherwise, I will have to now change each and every noise figure channel that was originally created on an Opt 28 Win XP PNA-X to fix the mismatch between the settings. 

As for the non-noise figure channels, as you stated below, because those noise figure related fields were not available, then that explains the random behavior of the noise tuner switch setting when recalling the csa files. I'll look into setting the preference for that as you suggested to see if that remedies my problem.

Thanks,
rok

只是仔细检查你的设置：你在一个没有029的盒子上保存了一个州;
然后你把它召回到DID有029并发现噪音调谐器开关处于错误状态的状态？
如果是这种情况，那么就没有一个简单的解决方案，因为噪声应用状态保存不知道从028保存设置噪声开关的方式（它没有保存为对象的一部分，因为它是
不在028框中）。
因此，当在029盒子上召回028状态时，我们可能会识别出要使用的028接收器（我认为我们正确地做到了）但我们只是不知道设置噪声开关的状态，所以我认为它会去
默认设置，如首选项所述。
我想，但我不确定，绕过调谐器的偏好会受到尊重，但也许不会（有时可以通过创建应用程序频道的新版本（设置所有默认设置）然后应用特定设置来回想起来）
从调用状态，所以缺少设置获取默认值）。
另一方面，如果您的情况是：我有一个029的盒子，保存了028状态和噪音开关，这是XP;
然后我在具有相同029硬件但在Win7中的盒子上回忆起它，它回忆错了;
那么这是一个应该修复的错误。
请确认哪些条件代表您的情况或是否是其他条件。



     以下为原文

  Just to double-check your setup:  You saved a state on a box that did NOT have 029; then you recalled it to a state that DID have 029 and found the noise tuner switch in the wrong state?

If that is the case, then there isn't a simple fix for this, because the noise app state save does not know which way to set the noise switch from the 028 save (it was not saved as part of the object since it is not in the 028 box).  Thus when an 028 state is recalled on an 029 box, we might recognize the 028 receiver to be used (I think we do that properly) but we just don't know which state to set the noise switch so I think it will go to the default settings, as described by the preferences.  I think, but I'm not sure, that the preference to bypass the tuner will be respected, but perhaps not (sometimes recall works by creating a new version of the app channel (with all the defaults set) and then applying the particular settings from the recall state, so missing settings get the default values).

If, on the other hand your situation is: I have a box with 029, saved an 028 state and noise switch, which was XP; then I recalled it on a box with the same 029 hardware but in Win7, and it recalled wrong; then this is a bug that should be fixed.  

Please confirm which of the conditions represent your situaiton or if it is something else.

嗨Joel博士，我的公司最初只有3台Win XP PNA-X，只有Opt 28和1台租用的Win XP PNA-X和H29选项。
但是，在设置噪声系数时，我们只使用选项28设置。
我们将租用WinXP PNA-X和H29噪声系数设置。
我尝试在创建基于选项28的噪声系数通道方面描述的情况，然后在WIN7 Opt 29 PNA-X上重新显示它，看它是否仍然错误地设置了噪声调谐器开关。
我明天会试试。
韩国



     以下为原文

  Hi Dr Joel,

My company originally had 3 Win XP PNA-X's with Opt 28 only and 1 rental Win XP PNA-X with the H29 option. However, in setting up the noise figure, we only use the Option 28 settings.

We will have the rental WinXP PNA-X with the H29 noise figure setting. I try the case you described in terms of creating an option 28 based noise figure channel and then recal it on the WIN7 Opt 29 PNA-X to see if it still is setting the noise tuner switch incorrectly. I'll try it tomorrow.

rok

> {quote：title = rok写道：} {quote}>对于Win7对话框，我们有'Tuner'和'Bypass'，加载的文件将其设置为'Tuner'，我假设它是指内置的
在内部电子调谐器。
并且'旁路'映射到'内部'。
不应该有第三种选择参考外部？
（如果内部电子调谐器工作不正常，并且需要一个选项才能继续使用外部电子调谐器）>>最后，我查看了“首选项”（在“实用程序”下）
“系统” - “配置”菜单树）但找不到允许我将“端口1噪声调谐器开关”设置为非噪声数字通道的某些默认设置的选项，就像您在回复中提到的那样。
你能告诉我在哪里可以找到并实现该功能吗？
>>谢谢，> rok所以你有一个50 GHz的内部调谐器，它没有外部状态。
调谐器处于或绕过。
50 GHz 029分析仪没有外部/内部开关。
也就是说，H29和029的硬件图是不同的。
前面板上的环路永远不会在029 50 GHz中被旁路（它在029 26GHz PNA-X中被旁路）。
我不相信我们在029 50 GHz上支持外部ecal调谐器，但它在列表中并且可能最近得到了支持。
需要一些研究才能确认。
出厂时，029 50 GHz仅支持使用内部调谐器的矢量NF cal。
因此，如果内部调谐器不工作，您需要修理它。
据我所知，我们从来没有内部调谐器失败，FWIW。
我很惊讶偏好被删除了，但它在029 50 GHz被移除，而它仍然在029 26和H29。
我本以为他们的偏好会被重置以引用调谐器旁路，但我猜测程序员认为“没有外部/内部，因此不需要偏好”。



     以下为原文

  > {quote:title=rok wrote:}{quote}

> For the Win7 dialog, we have 'Tuner' and 'Bypass', with the loaded file setting it to 'Tuner', which I am assuming is referring to the built-in internal E-cal tuner. And the 'Bypass' is mapping to 'Internal'. Shouldn't there be a 3rd choice to refer to the external? (in case perhaps if the internal e-cal tuner is not working properly and one needed an option to be able to still use the external e-cal tuner)
> 
> Finally, I looked through the 'Preferences' (under 'Utility'-'System'-'Configure' menu tree) but couldn't find the option that lets me set the 'Port 1 Noise Tuner Switch' to some default setting for non-noise figure channels, like you alluded to in your reply. Can you tell me where I can find and implement that feature?
> 
> Thanks,
> rok
So you have a 50 GHz with the internal tuner, and it does NOT have an external state.  The tuner is either in or bypassed.  There is no external/internal switch for the 50 GHz 029 analyzer.  That is, the hardware diagram for H29 and 029 are different.  The loop on the front panel is never bypassed in 029 50 GHz (it is bypassed in the 029 26GHz PNA-X).

I don't believe we yet support an external ecal tuner on an 029 50 GHz, but it was on the list and may have recently been supported. It would take a little research to confirm.  At shipment, the 029 50 GHz only supported vector NF cal using the internal tuner.  Thus if the internal tuner wasn't working, you would need to get it repaired.  As far as I can find out, we've never had an internal tuner fail, FWIW.

And I was surprised the preference was removed, but it is removed in 029 50 GHz, while it is still in the 029 26 and H29.  I would have thought that they preference would have been reset to refer to tuner bypass, but I"m guessing that the programmer figured "there is no external/internal, so no preference is needed".

嗨，Joel博士，由于该回切设置的“随机”性质，在调用仅在Win 28 PNA-X上创建的各种.csa文件（参见之前的帖子，示例说明这两种行为的示例附件），您的程序员是否可以
恢复该功能，特别是因为它存在于其他PNA-X配置中？
或者只是在调用没有为端口1噪声调谐器开关设置该位的状态文件时将其设置为一致设置？
这将节省我和很多其他用户从Win XP迁移到Win 7 PNA-X实现很多时间和麻烦，不必检查每个.csa文件，看看它发生了什么设置。
谢谢，rok



     以下为原文

  Hi Dr Joel,

Due to "random" nature of that switch setting in recalling various .csa files created on opt 28 only Win XP PNA-X's (see previous posts with sample attachments illustrating both behaviors), would it be possible for your programmers to restore that feature back, especially since it exists for other PNA-X configurations? Or just set it to a consistent setting whenever it is recalling a state file which doesn't have that bit set for the port 1 noise tuner switch? That would save me and a lot of other users migrating from the Win XP to Win 7 PNA-X implementation a lot of time and hassle in not having to check every .csa file to see what it happens to be set to.

Thanks,
rok

我通过正式的跟踪系统报告了这个问题。



     以下为原文

  I Have reported this issue through our formal tracking sytem.