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黄剑屏

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关于二次谐波测量

大家好,很抱歉再次提问。
这次是关于二次谐波测量。
有关测量设置,请参阅随附的jpg文件。
一些基本的解释。
SG以频率f0产生信号,然后使用低通滤波器(LPF)滤除SG二次谐波,隔离器以减少反射信号,从而稳定SG输出。
2dB ATT改善阻抗匹配。
SA在频率2 * f0处测量二次谐波。
此外,SA和SG 10MHz源被锁定在一起。
在附件中。
(a)用于设置;
(b)用于DUT测量。
在(a)中,SA经过仔细调谐,RBW = 1Hz,SPAN = 100Hz,优化输入衰减器以减少SA混频器失真。
(输入衰减器以2dB步进增加,直到2f0谐波信号电平在1dB内变化)。
在(b)中,SA设置与(a)相同,插入DUT并进行测量。
DUT是无源的,其插入损耗在f0处为0.5dB,在2 * f0处的衰减为15dB。
f0处的LPF(LC型)插入损耗为1dB,2 * f0处的衰减为55dB。
这是我们的测量结果:在设置(a)中,2 * f0处的谐波电平为-65dBm在设置(b)中,2 * f0处的谐波电平为-80dBm我的问题:(1)通常,对于谐波测量,
设置应具有更高的性能,以便正确进行DUT测量。
在我的测量中,我发现DUT结果比设置更好。
这是否意味着设置没有很好地配置/优化?
(2)根据测量结果,似乎2 * f0(15dB)处的DUT衰减与设置(a)和(b)差异完全匹配。
因此,在设置(b)中,我用两个相同的LPF替换LPF并且预期会有改进的结果,但是,我只看到2dB的改进,这是由于LPF损耗(1dB x 2 = 2dB)你的帮助将是
非常感谢!
你的,伊柳

以上来自于谷歌翻译


     以下为原文

  Hi, all,

sorry for asking question again.

This time, it is about the second hARMonics measurement.

Please refer to the attached jpg file for the measurement setup.

Some fundamental explanations.

SG generates the signal at frequency f0, then use low pass filter (LPF)to filter out the SG 2nd harmonics, isolator to reduce the reflected signal, hence to stabilize the SG output. 2dB ATT to improve impedance matching. SA measure the 2nd harmonics at frequency 2*f0. Further, SA and SG 10MHz source is locked together.

In the attached file. (a) is for the setup; (b) is for the DUT measurement.  
in (a), SA is carefully tuned, RBW=1Hz, SPAN=100Hz, input attenuator is optimized to reduce the SA mixer distortion. (input attenuator increased in its 2dB step, until the 2f0 harmonic signal level varies within 1dB).
in (b), SA setting is the same with (a), DUT inserted and do the measurement.  

DUT is passive, with its insertion loss being 0.5dB at f0, attenuation at 2*f0 is 15dB.  
LPF(LC type) insertion loss at f0 is 1dB, attenuation at 2*f0 is 55dB.

Here is our measurement result:
In setup (a), harmonic level at 2*f0 is -65dBm
In setup (b), harmonic level at 2*f0 is -80dBm

My questions:
(1) Normally, as for harmonic measurement, the setup should have greater performance in order to do the DUT measurement correctly. In my measurement, I found the DUT result better than the setup. Does this mean that the setup is not well configured/optimized?

(2) From the measurement results, it seems that the DUT attenuation at 2*f0 (15dB) exactly matches the setup (a) and (b) difference. Therefore, in setup(b), I replaced the LPF with two identical LPFs and expected to have improved results, however, I only see the 2dB improvements, which is due to the LPF loss (1dB x 2 = 2dB)

Your help would be highly appreciated!

Yours,
Yiliu   
附件

回帖(7)

黄剑屏

2018-11-23 10:26:16
关于上一篇文章中的问题(1)的一些解释。
对于失真测量,我的印象是,如果DUT具有优于设置的性能。
然后测量结果与设置几乎相同。
换句话说,设置失真信号将浸没更好的性能/更低失真信号电平。
然而,在我测量二阶谐波时,我发现DUT比设置好8dB。
仍然与这种现象混淆。
欢迎任何评论或帮助。
你的,伊柳

以上来自于谷歌翻译


     以下为原文

  Some explanations about question (1) in the previous post.

For distortion measurements, I have the impression that if the DUT is having superior performance than the setup. Then the measurement result would be almost the same with the setup. In other words, better performance/ lower distortion signal level will be immersed by the setup distortion signal.

However, in my measurement of the 2nd order harmonics, I found the DUT is 8dB better than the setup. Still confused with this phenomena.

Any comments or help are welcome.

Yours,
Yiliu
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黄剑屏

2018-11-23 10:35:22
引用: dkhwakd 发表于 2018-11-23 09:03
关于上一篇文章中的问题(1)的一些解释。
对于失真测量,我的印象是,如果DUT具有优于设置的性能。
然后测量结果与设置几乎相同。

通过将另一个LPF串行连接到当前LPF,我能够将设置的二次谐波降低到-90dBm,然后我将DUT测量为-85dBm。
我不确定我是否正确地进行了测量。
至少,DUT不如二阶谐波性能的设置。
欢迎任何评论

以上来自于谷歌翻译


     以下为原文

  By serial connecting another LPF to the current LPF, I am able to reduce the setup 2nd harmonics to -90dBm,
then I measure the DUT to be -85dBm. 

I am not sure whether I made the measurement correctly or not. At least, the DUT is inferior to the setup in second order harmonics performance.

Any comments are welcome
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张英

2018-11-23 10:47:34
引用: dkhwakd 发表于 2018-11-23 09:12
通过将另一个LPF串行连接到当前LPF,我能够将设置的二次谐波降低到-90dBm,然后我将DUT测量为-85dBm。
我不确定我是否正确地进行了测量。
至少,DUT不如二阶谐波性能的设置。

你使用什么信号发生器?
你的载频是多少?
射频功率是多少?
什么频谱分析仪?
频谱分析仪的射频衰减是多少?
输入混频器应低于-30或-40 dBm,具体取决于型号,如果低于2.9 GHz。
如果低于2.9 GHz,这可能是典型的,因为二次谐波失真规格为-70 dBc。
使用高Q BP滤波器可以找到更好的结果,因为它可以消除信号发生器的任何子谐波。

以上来自于谷歌翻译


     以下为原文

  What Signal generator are you using?  What is you carrier frequency. What RF power?  What spectrum analyzer?  What is the RF attenuation of the spectrum analyzer at?   It should be below - 30 or -40 dBm  to input mixer depending on model if below 2.9 GHz.    If below 2.9 GHz this could be typical as the 2nd harmonic distortion specification is - 70 dBc.   You may find better results with a high Q BP filter as it will eliminate any sub-harmonics from the signal generator.
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黄剑屏

2018-11-23 10:59:01
引用: 小佳99 发表于 2018-11-23 09:25
你使用什么信号发生器?
你的载频是多少?
射频功率是多少?

SG:Anritsu MG3602A Carrier freq。
:进入DUT的RF功率低于1GHz:15dBm SA:Agilent PSA E4440A SA输入衰减器:优化至58dB从您提供的值,以下计算是否正确?
Power @ mixer lvl:-30至-40 dBm二次谐波失真规格: - 70 dBc。
二次谐波信号lvl:-100到-110 dBm?
您的评论非常感谢!
你的,伊柳

以上来自于谷歌翻译


     以下为原文

  SG: Anritsu MG3602A
Carrier freq. : lower than 1GHz
RF power into the DUT: 15dBm
SA: Agilent PSA E4440A
SA input attenuator: optimized to 58dB

From values provided by you, is the following calculation correct?

Power @ mixer lvl: -30 to -40 dBm
2nd harmonic distortion specification: - 70 dBc. 
2nd harmonic signal lvl: -100 to -110 dBm?

Your comment is highly appreciated!

Yours,
Yiliu
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